Hello! I was wondering why I See Red ends so abruptly on Frenzy? My CD version and the version I had from Napster both ended without a fade or proper sounding ending! Was this because of its hasty addition to the LP when it originally was pressed?

I also thought it might be a pressing error at first, but the single version and the video clip both end exactly the same way (in the video the band members just "disappear" suddenly, leaving behind an empty room). For whatever reason I guess they just decided to end the song with a massive anti-climax.

I love the ending of that song. I think it was meant to leave you a little disoriented, wondering if your CD player skipped or something. I think it's pretty brilliant and effective and it makes me laugh every time I hear it.

yeah, i love the way it ends too. it's as if it all works up and then someone's come along with a knife and sliced the end off it. i think it's great!

I was a bit shocked when I first heard the Frenzy version, as the first version I heard was on the 'Best of' compilation (Chrysalis, 1993?) which fades out at the end.....

Spence - the version of "I See Red" on the "Best of" CD - can you tell if it's identical to the Frenzy mix, or are there more synth layers?

I have a rough cassette dub of an alternate mix which fades at the end, but am now curious to know if this ended up on CD.

Hmmmm..I have the alternate version of Frenzy(with Livin' It Up) on cassette somewhere round here,and I think 'I See Red' cuts off short on there as well.I've heard the fade too,but I much prefer the abrupt ending..just seems to fit the frantic pace of the song better,IMHO
This may be off topic,but was that Frenzy ever released on Cd?

Brandi

The remixed Frenzy with the Luton tracks on side 2 has never been released on CD.

Not officially anyway

Note to lawyers - I jest.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Ansell:
[qb]The remixed Frenzy with the Luton tracks on side 2 has never been released on CD.[/qb]

More's the pity...

quote:

the version of "I See Red" on the "Best of" CD - can you tell if it's identical to the Frenzy mix, or are there more synth layers?

Jeremy, I'm no good at spotting differences in mixes, and I don't have my copy of the Best Of with me at the mo. Can't remember any obvious differences though, although I guess it might have been remastered etc (isn't that what the normally do before putting out most compilations?) Gotta agree with Jean, the abrupt ending is fab - totally unexpected on first listen, leaves you wondering what the hell is going on as Give It A Whirl kicks in.

Hi, everyone! The way "I see red" ends is far from usual, on that I agree. How did the band get it on stage? On "The Living Enz" it gets away quite tricky, I can't really appreciate what's their idea of ending the track or merging into something else... and unfortunately I still haven't got "Anniversary" nor any other live source to assist... Bye. Hi, everyone!

I have the A&M version of Frenzy on vinyl and would love to transfer it to either cd or my computer--is there any way of doing this? Send me a personal if you know how. This would be for my own listening and would just be more convenient for me.

Yes, you can use a software system called Audacity (easily located using google). There are others, but I'm not sure of names. You need to run a line from your stereo system to the microphone input jack on your computuer - works like a charm. I'm in the process of converting a lot of my old LPs from the 70's and 80's. Sure beats paying a ton of money to replace them!!

If no-one has mentioned it, I heard that there was an ending to I See Red, but the tape ran out when they were recording it and they left it as is was ... could be completely wrong, but that's what I heard!

If the tape running out story is to be believed...

It would have happened at the mixing stage, and in that case, whoever was mixing the track (David Tickle) would have just got another reel of 1/4" or 1/2" Mastering tape.

If it was the multitrack tape and they were recording it, they would have tidied it up as they went.

Unless either A)Tickle's Mix was so perfect that he feared he'd never get it that perfect again, so they went with it.

Or B)Most of the recording was done live by the band, all playing at the same time. Overdubs done later. And the band feared they'd never get the performance down like it again, so they went with it, and tidied it up as much as possible.

We're talking about two different tapes here that could have run out. If one ran out, i'd say most likely the former, the mix tape. But as Jaffa says above, an alternative mix exists, which would support the latter theory.

But considering that it was recorded in a completely different session to the rest of Frenzy (meaning it'd be on a new, different tape), and the fact it's only 3 minutes long, and most multitracks run for 15-20 Minutes, Mastering tape runs for longer, i doubt the running out theory. Plus Tickle was supposed to be an excellent engineer. Any engineer worth their salt makes sure to check tapes. Not doing that is a firing offence. And Tickle came back to do True Colours.

The theory i'd say is most plausible is that the tape of the mix got damaged whilst being mastered. and they lost the end. That or Split Enz were just messing with our heads.

As usual, all of the above is hypothesis. Don't have any concrete facts to go on, so i'm guessing.

Having not heard Enzology, I don't know if this is covered in that. But maybe someone, anyone, who actually knows would put us out of our misery on this one.

from what I could hear, the Best Of is the same...but don't quote me.

I love it its so great. I went to the recent Finn Bros concert last year and it was just the best. Dad and I jumped like a pogo when I See Red came on, and Neil and Tim *priest chant: Neil Tim Neil Tim* went WAY longer than normal and then they finished up all sweaty and stuff and the entire room just erupted!
It was just fab...really just fab. I'm SO glad I went and am definately going to see the next...
sorry, I just realised I went Off topic...but back on topic, I think the whole difference with the fade out stuff was cos it might have been an earlier version...then they cahnged their minds? dunno...

I sent a hopeful email off to Tickle and sent him a link to this topic, asking him if he would like to share his thoughts on I See Red from his perspective.

Here's his reponse....

"Thanks for the enquiry. I See Red was the first of two songs recorded on that one date, I don't recall any tape running out. The mix at the time was the only mix done and I was surprised to see it released as I never was paid for the session. It is possible that Malcolm the drummer may have run out of steam at the end of the song as it was a high energy track if that was so I may have faded it before it finally fell apart. But I thought the track had achieved what we had set out to do. Hope this helps, all the best, David Tickle."

Anselm, three cheers for sending that email, and thanks to David Tickle for that response.

If what DT says is correct, where does this rough mix that Jaffaman mentions above come in?
Unless it sounds different before mastering. I know that it's possible. My vinyl copy of Together Alone (Simply Vinyl re-issue) sounds like it was subtley mixed different, but i put it down to a different mastering process than the cd. It's quite possible that those synth layers would be more prominent on an unmastered mix (it still being the same mix), or are slightly masked by different compression techniques on the master of the mix. Maybe we should move this to the Sound On Sound or Rec.Audio.Pro forum!

It's interesting that he mentions never being paid for the session. To come back and produce two more albums for them, he must have really loved their music. I know that there's sessions I've never been paid for (even though there was an agreed rate), but i've still gone back to do more sessions with the artist because i loved the music.

Good to get this additional information thrown into the pot from Mr. Tickle.

It's definitely a remix that I have, Iarla. Maybe Eddie had another go at it when he remixed "Frenzy" but decided to go with the original in the end.