From Texas Rose:

quote:

Nothing so sad as self-inflicted ingnorance.

Exactly. The "Machine" they're raging against owes its entire existence to the fact that these neanderthals take their rage to music festivals rather than the voting booth. They only have themselves to blame for an administration that was able to steal an election by bedding down with a minority of religious extremists. They rely on the predictability that these people don't care enough to vote. That's the irony of the whole thing.

Thank you, Crowded House, for not retreating when faced with this kind of fake mob hostility. I think they understood what it was; that it was more a reflection on the mob than on themselves, and had the dignity to not be insulted by it.

Will look forward to the day when I'll see the band in a venue surrounded by the kind of people who value and respect the relevance of peace and beauty.

RR

Just to show another side to the experience...
I arrived at Coachella just in time to catch the second half of Willie Nelson. My friend and I hung back until CH was about to go on, then we moved up to about 30 yards of the stage to the right. There were plenty of Rage fans all around us and they could barely contain their excitement even though there were two full shows to go.

When the band began, you could see the power of When You Come working on the crowd near me. Neil seemed intent on tearing it up on guitar throughout the show and a lot of non-fans seemed to appreciate it. A couple of guys that had been talking about Rage when the song started quieted down and watched the show. The set was going great until the bottle throwing incident, which seemed to shake the whole band. Silent House got the band and the audience back into it full swing. By the time they got to Something So Strong, one of the two Rage guys was dancing and singing along, he knew all the words. I realize their were a bunch of jerks out there, but there were some decent folks that were open to it as well.

On another note, I thought Rage Against the Machine were terrible. Morello is a great musician who practically kills himself trying to make bland music sound interesting. There were a couple of infectious grooves, but the more I listened, the more I felt that getting mad at Rage fans for their behavior is like getting mad at a monkey for flinging it's feces. They just don't have the brain capacity to understand why it is wrong.

quote:

Exactly. The "Machine" they're raging against owes its entire existence to the fact that these neanderthals take their rage to music festivals rather than the voting booth. They only have themselves to blame for an administration that was able to steal an election by bedding down with a minority of religious extremists. They rely on the predictability that these people don't care enough to vote. That's the irony of the whole thing.

Point of order - can we please keep this debate in context, on topic (about Crowded House and their music) and not let this debate become a discussion about politics or religion.

Thanks.

I agree with everyone who says CH deserve better, because they really DO deserve better than this reception.

I've always thougt that festivals are some sort of "risk" for any band, in an attempt to gain more and new fans. Often that works: I already knew and liked their music when they totally won me (and I'm sure many others there) over at the T/W-festival 15 years ago. Too bad it didn't go like that at Coachella.

One thing that's not clear to me: is it allowed to bring bottles to a festival in the US and the UK? Here in Belgium bottles have not been allowed for like 15 or 20 years for safety reasons.

quote:

Originally posted by lamb:
Here in Belgium bottles have not been allowed for like 15 or 20 years for safety reasons.

Is that true of plastic bottles, as well?

quote:

Originally posted by lamb:
One thing that's not clear to me: is it allowed to bring bottles to a festival in the US and the UK? Here in Belgium bottles have not been allowed for like 15 or 20 years for safety reasons.

I can only speak for Coachella, but this year everyone was allowed to bring in ONE sealed bottle of water, and no empty bottles. In past years no outside bottles, full or empty, were allowed at all. Security was VERY strict... I saw people at the gate having to throw away headache pills, pens, oranges, energy bars and maglites. Of course, no glass of any kind was allowed. Small plastic bottles of water were on sale in the festival for $2 each. These were the bottles that were thrown at CH...

quote:

I'm afraid my opinion of festivals remains unchanged. The band you like plays a very short set, half the audience doesn't really want to hear them, and you have to stand there in the midst of an unruly mob trying to take pleasure in the delicacies of the music. I don't think festivals are the place for CH, and I don't think it is the place to go and see them unless you're prepared to put up with this kind of thing and accept that everybody's taste is different.

In defence of the festival dates that CH are doing in the UK and Ireland though this summer, they are teaming up with Peter Gabriel, I personally feel it will be a totally different atmosphere from Coachella. I think that festivals only really work when the different acts tend to have many fans in common, which is clearly not the case with RATM. It's good to read though that not all RATM fans weren't acting like morons and to be fair it was probably a minority.

It looks to me as though they will be trying to get people to realise that they're back in time for the new album and then I reckon they'll return to the UK with something more like a tour.

I can see your point though Sad Claude and definitely agree that I'd prefer to see Crowded House play smaller venues rather than arenas, although if I have the choice of arenas or nothing I'll take arenas anyday.

As for the water bottles, they were passed out for free by the festival itself. Because of the heat and the people all packed in together, occassionally the organizers would throw out free bottles. The bottles were thrown around open to cool down the crowd. It is possible that the one that hit Neil was an accident, but I doubt that.

I choose not to go to that type of show or festival for fear of that type of behaviour.

Those louts weren't raging against any machine, they were behaving badly towards other human beings. You don't need a surname of Einstein to be able to figure that out.

I'm also glad to hear that it was a minority.

Perhaps next time Crowded House are inappropriately booked with other acts, the organisers will hand round paper cups of water instead. (I think someone may have already suggested this!).

I notice that this thread is "...Webcast Crowded House..." It made me wonder whether the whole thing was filmed. It would be good to think that there was footage of those louts doing their thing. I think they should be named and shamed.

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I notice that this thread is "...Webcast Crowded House..." It made me wonder whether the whole thing was filmed. It would be good to think that there was footage of those louts doing their thing. I think they should be named and shamed.

I was so fired up when it happened I was tempted to make my way to the control booth to see if I could find footage of who threw it. I was there with my roommate and we are both big guys. If it had happened anywhere where I saw it, the Crowded House name would have been defended, whether that is in the spirit of the band or not.

I just read a Reuters report on Coachella and while it doesn't mention Crowded House, it does state that during the Arctic Monkeys' performance, former Faith No More singer Mike Patton, "wearing a do-rag and a faux bulletproof vest, led the crowd on an adjacent stage into mocking laughter directed at the English band."

and I was reading some posts on the Coachella message board (I'm seriously trying to avoid a pile of homework) and lots of people are blaming the festival promoters for scheduling CH to be the "sacrificial lamb" for RATM fans.

If similarly Anglo-inspired pop bands like Fountains Of Wayne and The New Pornographers are "relevent" enough to "belong" at Coachella, how ridiculous is it to say the opposite of Crowded House? I know Adam Schlesinger from FOW worships Neil's songwriting. In their own way, the bands mentioned and others like The Raconteurs are aiming for the same goal as Crowded House--finely crafted, intelligent, melodic pop. Only Crowded House did it 10-20 years ago, often better, and are still totally capable of it. Just a token rant..

A highly unfortunate occurence...and one that is unlikely to occur ever again based on future bookings.

I'm sure they wish they could get out there and wash the bad taste out of their mouth over this bottle thing, although they've probably moved on my now.

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Only Crowded House did it 10-20 years ago, often better, and are still totally capable of it. Just a token rant..

Yeah, well, indie music is just so much of a "scene" now that it attracts so many blissfully ignorant, conformist trendies. As usual, majority of the intelligent songwriters and innovative musicians don't get any credit. It seems to me these kids diss CH mostly because the only CH song they know is a mainstream hit. It's funny that many of the hipster acts they salivate over are lauded for rehashing 80s music by greater bands like CH.

I'm not really as old as I sound..

http://myspace.com/vivycakes

Just silliness....I've put it to bed for good and hope for better dreams tomorrow...

quote:

Originally posted by Romer:

quote:

Originally posted by lamb:
Here in Belgium bottles have not been allowed for like 15 or 20 years for safety reasons.

Is that true of plastic bottles, as well?

Yep. They were finally banned at every festival after Iggy Pop asked the crowd to throw empty plastic bottles in the air to show their enthusiasm. Unfortunately some were not empty...

quote:

Originally posted by proudpom:

I can only speak for Coachella, but this year everyone was allowed to bring in ONE sealed bottle of water, and no empty bottles. In past years no outside bottles, full or empty, were allowed at all. Security was VERY strict... I saw people at the gate having to throw away headache pills, pens, oranges, energy bars and maglites. Of course, no glass of any kind was allowed. Small plastic bottles of water were on sale in the festival for $2 each. These were the bottles that were thrown at CH...

I thought the heat would explain the bottles. Thanks for clearing that up for me.


I try to look on the positive side now: it can only get better from here for Crowded House. Especially if we keep showing our support at CH-gigs.

I’m 15 years old 70 years ago and my favourite bands are Megadeth and The Cowsills. However, I realise that melodic pop music is dated because it is too nice and does not make me angry at a government that sanctions killing. Killing is not a very nice thing to do, as we all know. I don't like going to concerts because people trample on too many ants. Do any of you know that ants do not like Rage Against the Machine? Am I still relevant?

I found some RATM/CH commentary on the Austin City Limits Festival message board :

http://www.austincitylimits.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=34382&mpage=4

um, any news on this having been archived yet?

I'm actually a big fan of both RATM and Crowded House - However when I'm the mood for one, it's hard to be in the mood for the other. They appeal to different sides of me.

For all the complaints about scheduling, I would imagine that CH's management tried very hard to not be in that timeslot. In the end these things come down to someone somewhere not having CH as one of their priorities, a promoter or festival organiser somewhere. I think everyone would agree that a different time slot and/or stage would have been more suited to the band, the needs of their fans, and more conducive to them finding an audience, but obviously some other act's needs were deemed to be of greater importance in the scheme of things. It happens all the time, I've seen really great acts get really ***ty billing at festivals simply because they ain't new and hot.

I would think that the members of RATM themselves would have been very disapproving of the way that a group of their fans treated CH, as it would go against their ethos to show such ignorant disrespect to another act.

It's just another case of the followers completely not getting the message of the leaders, and thus giving everyone a bad name - Which let's face it, is an age old problem in every sphere.